Is there anything in your house made in China? Or...is there anything that isn't made in China?

well my fine china is made in japan... go figure

I just knew that would be the first one. Ok that's out of the way. Anyone shop at China Mart aka Wal-Mart?

yes, the nuclear arms dept of the Chinese military..

Hmmmm....I guess there is a need for that in NYC.

nuclear and NYC should not be put together >_>

And my china's from Germany ...

wait...why is china named china?

technically it's made up of two words... Chi-Na...now go do your homework and find out what they mean, andrew

Here you go lad... Wiki is your friend

This should keep you ouyt of the streets for awhile. :o)

rob is evil to me...just sometimes...just...sometimes...
and zomg...too much to read...lol. i'm too tired to read at this hour -_-

evil? me???? damn right i am...betta reconize, son.. word!

So, Jerry ... you were against NAFTA? Perhaps?

Ponder this ...

Ratio of the average manufacturing wage in the United States to that in Mexico, before NAFTA took effect in 1994: 6:1 (U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics)

Ratio today: 8:1

I have no room for NAFTA nor the regionalization of the U.S., Canada, and Mexico...that's the reason for NAFTA. It's a move toward globalization. Eventually ten regions led by 10 kings. If you see it then you will see prophecy fulfilled. The ball is now rolling and NAFTA is helping to launch it.

Ok ... but an interpretation of the statistic I presented you with, would give the impression, that as a result ... one of ... that the manufacturing sector experienced a positive affect as a result of NAFTA.

That's a good thing, no?

Baby steps here Jerry ... one thing at a time. And no, not a slight against your view presented. That is a quantum leap for me ... well, that is not quite true ... the centralization of power and money is not new news.

It does contradict the concept of the 'free market' thinking though. And here, all I am saying is the optimum allocation of resources ... whether those resources are capital, people or natural.

Free market for who? And does the manufacturing sector affect you other than making your wallet lighter? Who does all the manufacturing? Not us. But then this is where China Mart comes in. We have become a servant class who parts with our cash for trinkets (junk at that) manufactured in places like China, Mexico, Bangladesh, and Taiwan to name a few and sold at the Trinket Marts here. There is a global plan for us...some day you won't be able to buy or sell unless you belong to the order. If you don't go along with the program they will simply starve you out.

*pulls out soapbox*

And do you know how workers are treated in other countries w/such low wages? Factory workers in China LIVE @ the factory, work 12 hours a day minimum and have one day off a month. That's right. You heard me. A month. And you would not believe the difference in markup @ the retail level. I know my company sold a table & chair set to Target for $37.99 (which was already their profit over cost markup)… which Target sold for $59.99. Ouch?

And for this… some people tryin to make a living in China got paid $2/hr. Oh... you didn't think they actually got GOOD wages for living @ the factory and working themselves into the ground did you?

*puts soapbox away*
*goes off to comment on more images*

the sad truth is that we HAVE just become a nation of consumers. and not just in the sense associated with commerce and trade. we really do just.... consume and consume, until either we've tired ourselves of that particular thing or resource, or we've exhausted it's supply. i remember a food chain here in nyc closed it's doors to the warehouse. people boycotted the store, picketed..the whole nine yards.... now, something like that happens, and people yawn about it on their way to Home Depot, Walmart, etc.

u mean that Pergament store??? or i'm just way off...again...

actually, i was referring to King Kullen...i did say food chain, and pergament was a hardware chain..just to clarify..

oh i guess i missed the food chain thing...lol.

Food chain Andrew? You are on it.

i'm on the top of the chain.

I heard it was the bottom. Rumour is that you were made in China.

i was made in NY :(

depending on the neighborhood, those two are a blurry distinction at best...

I think it’s extremely important that when you discuss a subject such as this you try and avoid grafting on Western values, methods and working practices directly onto a culture that has relation to our own. And never has.

It’s wrong to perceive that these factories are slave like sweatshops purely on your own circumstances. Yes, people do live at plants in China but this isn’t a forced issue to keep them there. Live in accommodation at factories is a much sought after perk – you have to remember that large plants in China can employ as many as 200,000 people – in a factory like that there will be at most, accommodations for 30,000 workers and these are always subject to huge demand and waiting lists. A typical Chinese working week does consist of about 60 hours work but this is usually split over six days. Yes, the average pay is $2 an hour but remember before, the explosion in western involvement and investment in Chinese manufacturing, pay was set at 57 cents per hour – and that’s as recently as 2002. China is beginning to face the same problems as India as higher pay is leading to higher expectations and demand for work – with manufacturing wages rising by a minimum of 15% a year they are finding themselves in the midst of an employment shortage that could see a bursting of the boom bubble they have at the moment. If they do manage to sustain the growth they are experiencing, the Chinese minimum wage will pass that of the USA by the beginning of the next decade. Consequently, the gap opens up between cost of living and earnings giving many Chinese families the singularly unique situation of having spare cash available over and above their living costs.

There is a huge amount of hysteria and misinformation flying around with regard to Asian business and culture; I suspect a great deal of that comes from a xenophobic place. As has been already pointed out, it is rampant western consumerism that is the driving force behind this and just as China’s manufacturing bubble may burst – so may the west’s consumer gluttony bubble. If you aren’t happy with domestic companies sourcing products from china – don’t buy them and write to the company telling them why you aren’t buying their Chinese products. Just make sure it’s a valid reason like that you would prefer to support your own countries economy and buy domestic sourced produce and not simply misinformed hysterics.

Phil, my info comes from factories that my company deals with... they are the types of factories that I'm describing where it's more like 85+ hours a week, and there is literally one day off a month.

While I agree that it's a different standard all around, and may well be a better standard of living than previously enjoyed... my issue is with the huge profits being enjoyed by the companies selling the products of such workers… which the workers themselves do not reap the benefit of.

There's also my disgust for corporate welfare and CEO's w/big fat salaries and pension plans in general... and frankly anything to do with "trickle down economics"

You’re going to get that in any culture Cat – no more so than our own and I completely agree with you on that. The figures I mentioned are the state set rules, if companies are breaking that – it is the responsibility of the western corporations backing these ventures to enforce these rules and preserve the workers rights. Again – consumers should use that as an argument to put to the western companies involved.

It’s very early days really for the new Chinese economy and their workers but these people are reaping the rewards for it already and will continue to do so. In many respects Chinese families are already reaching the point where their standard of living surpasses a western equivalent – albeit relatively speaking. For instance, a family living in a provincial area need only have one parent to work in a regulated manufacturing plant to sustain the family and still have surplus money, I doubt many western countries could confidently claim the same – such is the differential in costs of living. Personal growth must be sustainable and managed – too much too soon will cause more problems than it solves, eastern European countries can testify to that after the break of the eastern block, but this, of course, shouldn’t be to the detriment of the people involved. As employee shortages increase – this will in turn strengthen the position of the employees themselves making them more of an asset to their employers rather than a commodity.