Every so often I get a "comment request" under my jobs in the left menu. I give my honest opinion as best as I can in compliance with the commenting guidelines. And then sometimes I receive bashing and insults from people who can't handle honest opinions in my PMs and through other channels. How do you deal with this? Do you ignore this, do you appologize or do you try to explain your views in more detail? Do you continue to give honest opinions or do you adjust your commenting style and be careful not to hurt anyones feelings again?

First of all, my first consideration before commenting on any image is that there is a person behind that image who took the time to create it and share it. Occasionally people will upload images and actually state that they're not happy with the image, but they're stuck and need helpful suggestions. That's rare though. Most people don't upload images that they think are bad. Rather they share images that, as LynEve put it, they believe are "worth sharing."

By and large, IMO, there is something positive to be found in every image on this site. I'm with Sam in that, if I can't find anything positive in an image to comment on, I refrain from commenting. I value the time and care that artists take enough not to limit my comments to negatives. I may not like every image, but that doesn't make such images poor. There's a lot of subjectivity involved in critiquing images and, if I offer a criticism or suggestion for change, I try to qualify such comments as "my opinion." Wen

Its a bit like 'everyone wants to go to heaven but nobody wants to die' We all want coments but no one wants to be hurt, and in the end its all a matter of personal opinion regardless of technical excellence which is rare.
One of my recent flower pics includes a thread of a spider web which one person saw as a bonus and another regarded as a fault. I occassionally respond to a criticism explaining the reason for a certain aspect of an upload, hopefully politely, and not as a crybaby.
So getting back to miran's original question, if you feel you have nothing to apologize for then don't, but going back and explaining further your reasons may soften the blow to someone who may have been hurt and discouraged by a curtly worded criticism.
The words critique and criticism are misunderstood by some people,and suggest disapproval.Perhaps 'peer appraisal' or 'peer assessment' would be alternatives.

*cough* *cough* >_>

No pain no gain....stupid is as stupid does...It's the same with the critique and no that does not mean judge or criticize. If someone does bad work and can't except critiquing or no one wants to hurt the persons feelings then that person continues to do bad work. If you give them a good revue even if it's bad work then you just snowed them into thinking they may be doing good...then you go barf behind their back. If they can't except criticism then let them do their thing. They simply aren't in to art or photography and it will be a short lived and passing fancy.

I think the point is the way in which the criticism is given. If it is given without a hint of encouragement then the person will never improve, they will give up and go and take up knitting as a hobby. A critique can be given without hurting a person's feelings if it is worded so that it is seen as a way of helping the artist to do better. It is the ones that only condemn a work without suggestions for betterment that are damaging. One could say 'I do not like this, the frame is awful, the composition is poor and the quality is not up to standard' but what would be the use of that if I could not offer suggestions for correcting the perceived faults ? Is there any harm in adding 'but the colours are nice' An ounce of praise is worth a pound of criticism.

I never suggested LYING to someone about how you view their work. That, indeed, would be disrespectful. Any compliment I leave about someone's work I am serious about or I wouldn't leave it.

I like LynEve's "peer" appraisal characterization. When it comes to "commenting" on images here, I really don't feel comfortable playing "judge" or even "critic" of the work of others. Rather, I leave comments to recognize the "worth" of someone else's work in my view. That certainly can include tactful "critiques" offered as helpful suggestions to improve the image, but I'm not in a position to "judge" the relative quality or value of other people's work.

If you think someone else's work is "bad," that's your opinion, but I do think we need to be careful in assuming some position of "authority" in assessing the work of others. We ARE "peers" here, who can hopefully grow artistically through our participation here. Comments should be honest, but respectful. Wen

One more word from me - or rather two
Wen's "honest and respectful" covers it.
In equal portions.

Do unto others. . . .etc.

Let me ask you Wendy...do you vote in the VB? If you do you judge. Your score good or bad is a judgement of the quality and appearence of that photo.

And do unto others....fear of the critique?

Let's see a show of hands: .. who had trouble following that?

The answer Keifer is to run fast and leave no trail. (hands going up and down in frustration) Be kind, be gentle but tell the truth. Sometimes too many kind words obscure the constructive criticism.

I knew someone would understand.

I was tired .. it was late ... I had been sent to bed without my dinner

I can follow it now .. (*sheepish grin*)

Sent to bed without dinner? Sheesh..that had to hurt. Happy Holidays hope that helps.

Sure that helps .. I don't know of any place where good cheer isn't the coin of the realm

(*cough*)

Merry Christmas to all

I can only speak for myself, but, truly value criticism of all kinds. If people say something is good, great, as long as they are honest. If someone slams one of my images inside out, as long as it’s truthful and honest, then I truly value it.

I do the same. However, I tend to only comment on the images that really grab my interest. Otherwise, there are so many images on this site, I’d be over 455 years old before I even got halfway through commenting.

well then i guess you have your work cut out for you... :P (like i should talk :| )

Sure glad Christmas is over...that white eyebrow is beginning to scare me.

It's just his real age showing Jerry, the magic beans have worn off ...

Magic beans eh.....worn off? Don't look at his shorts.

no, that's the magic beanstalk ;o)

.... and then ... Rob wakes up.

no, it usually in the reverse chronological order...but um..regarding age, first of all i'm younger than thou, and i can walk in a yard without tripping :P

Wow, this is the longest thread ever that I've started. It makes me so proud. My baby... :-))))

Yeah! Shame half of the comments didn't count...

One thing yea shall notice about the "escapees" here at Caedes. Hijacking and taking threads off topic is a favorite passtime here. We leave no stone, or opening, unturned. :o)

*tickles Miron's baby thread under the chin*
Coo-coo-cooo?

I frequently leave suggestions in addition to positive comments and so far the only responses I've had have been by way of thanks. I've also thanked people for critical as well as positive comments and can truthfully say that I really do value their honesty. I still don't get comments which fit the C-indexes my images get and I really wish that more people would comment honestly so I had some more idea how I might improve.

I've had only one comment which really annoyed me, although I did not even consider complaining to the commentator. That one simply said that the image was not the commentator's style of picture. I just thought this was pointless. I call the page up to see what somebody has said about the image and all I'm told is that the person doesn't like the style with no further explanation. I assume this was in response to a comment request, but I try to say something constructive and thoughtful about images I get requests for even if the pictures are not "my style" and I have no technical expertise either. If I can't find something to say, I don't leave a comment. I figure if somebody has taken the time and trouble to upload the image after preparing it, I should say something about their specific image if I say anything at all. It's not that I might not admit that an image isn't to my taste - I often do. What I objected to was leaving a comment which said _only_ that.

Sometimes I look through the person's gallery before commenting as well. At least one person asked to comment on an image of mine did the same thing and was able to balance criticism of that image with more positive comments about some of my others. So that's another possibility.

So if you are ever asked to comment on one of mine, please feel free to be honest!

- cfr

I see you do fractals. I'm not an expert on fractals but I do know they and some other art uploads don't get a fair shake in the VB. I vote not only by eye appeal but technical merit and the complexity of the work. Don't do a bunch of squiggley lines and expect a good score from me...I can do that. I realize how hard some of those are and the level of difficulty involved. I have much respect for the fractal and other computer artists. They have imagination and patience...something we all need more of. So c'mon people let's vote these artists up a little, consider the effort too.

On the subject of fractals and things like that, I know very little about them, so my votes are mostly based on first impression appeal and uniqueness. First the image actually needs to look good (composition, colours, etc) and second, it's no good if it's been done a thousand times before. The first time I saw one of those squiggly apophysis flame thingies in voting booth I thought 'wow, this is beautiful' and gave it an 8 or a 9 or something like that. But after seeing almost the exact same thing for the 378th time, I'm not convinced anymore and usually give a 1 or a 2.

If you've seen it before, then at the very least, it's "average" and should be given a 5 - 1's and 2's should be reserved for those images that have little or no artistic merit or have severe technical difficulties like extreme pixelation.

*steps back and runs away from the thread* oh boy… you're in trouble now!
*passes by the villagers w/their pitchforks on the way out*

It could be said that EVERYTHING has been photographed before YOU .. ie, it's been done 1000 times before

it's really not that difficult to be fair and balanced in your daily activities

Of course I tend to exaggerate a lot when I speak. It actually happens very rarely that I rate an image with a 1 or 2, fractal or otherwise. But I always try to be fair and balanced. I vote low on low quality snapshots of pretty flowers just as I vote low on low quality fractals with no aesthetic and artistic value. And I give out 8's, 9's and 10's to all types of pictures as well as long as I feel they are worth it.

To be fair, these low quality fractals don't seem to come up very often now. In fact, just earlier I went through many pages in the new images gallery trying to find an example of a worthless fractal that has been seen a thousand times before, and I couldn't find one! There were a few that I would have rated with 3's, 4's and 5's but none in the "absolute crap" range. There were one or two "absolute crap" pretty flowers though...

I think technical merit should account for about 1/3 of the vote but here that is rarely considered. It takes a lot of effort to get any art work or photo technically acceptable. And if it weren't for Photoshop there would be far fewer professional photographers so to them effort is everything in the professional arena being there has has to be at least a billion of them competing for the $. But then we must stay in the realm of reality here because this is a wallpaper site and nothing more. No money is made and it's not a competition. Still if we are going through the motions we should judge a work by all merits not just 'oh that's purdy, I gave it a 10' and it's tilted, shows camera shake,is off color, and full of noise...but it's purdy. At least we can learn something along the way. So rather than have a daily schmooze fest we could vote a work on all it's merits and short comings...not on a professional level of course because as far as I know very few if any here are pros. If there are pros let them speak up when commenting. Most pros would shred most everything here in one way or another. Everyone wants to learn...till they get a less than perfect comment then the commentor goes on the Troll list. Oh yes....wallpaper site, who wants to put someone's vacation snapshots on their desktop besides Curt?

Pardon me… I may have made myself misunderstood… I take off for technical problems, but do not slam the entire image because of them. That should have been little or no artistic merit AND extreme technical difficulties.

Hey, hey, hey... *shakes finger at Jerry*

Sorry Curt....I suppose I would be a hypocrite if I left yours up on my desktop...good thing no one can see it. My wife was a bit disgusted with the ones of you at the nude beach though...she thought it was very small of you to do that.

The water was cold... That's my story and I'm sticking to it. :oP

Thats what they all say :)

Apparently pretty cold ... :)

*checks weather record, which indicates it hovered around 80° that day*

lmaooooooooooooo

Caught him in a wee fib did we?

I am keeping an open mind ... or trying to ... could you explain how this comment of yours fits the criteria? And more so, this was this members' first post ... tell me how this is encouraging?

And I quote (you, that is);

"I'm sure it must have been very nice on that island but this photo is quite aweful. It is way overexposed in the sky and ocean areas and the rest has very poor contrast. Composition is good though... "

And I suspect that this comment of yours was the impetuus to you creating this thread, so, give this one a go as well ... and I really am curious as to your responses.

Quoting, you again:

"The composition works very well in this photo, but it is lacking in clarity, contrast and definition. The severely blown out sky isn't something to be happy about either."

Well, to his credit, it is honestly spoken. Harsh, but none the less, honest.

Perhaps what could have also been said, are some pointers as to how it could have been improved by drawing on his own technical skills.

I agree with you, to an extent Curt.

I, myself have no problem with a dissenting view, or opinion. As it is just that ... an opinion from another.

My point here is ... and I await Mirans' reply, since I could be wrong ... and he did express himself exceptionally well with the posting of this topic ... that curt and terse do not translate well over the web. (Excuse the pun of sorts.) Tread carefully in those areas, would be my counsel.

Miran seems quite capable behind the lens. I saw no suggestions for improvement. That would have tempered the commentary somewhat in my mind.

Annnnnd ... truthfully ... I found the title of this thread ... offensive. There ... there you have what was 'stuck in my craw' (however, that is spelled).

Me needs coffee now.

*goes off to caffeinate the savage beast*

Hallelujah .. we have attained a LINK'Less society .. and they said it couldn't be done in our lifetime

BAH !! .. never doubt again

Hmm, yeah, if the author of the photo I was commenting earlier was to attack me with a Hawaiian fish gutting knife, it would be justified because in this case the comment really wasn't very nice. Sorry. But then again at least I was honest. The photo is so overexposed that close to half of the pixels are pure white. I gave it a 1/10 in VB because IMO that's what it deserves and then wrote the comment. You're right, I should have given a few words of encouragement and how the photo could be made better. I'll correct that in a minute... :)

Sarcasm doesn't translate very well either Miran.

I do appreciate your effort to correct this though. This is a new member, that should be the consideration at the forefront.

Thank you.

And in future, there is no repercussion to not responding to "Comment Requests." You may ignore them if you wish.

About the other comment, can you give a link? I can't find it anywhere. I want to go back and reevaluate.

By the way, there are a couple other sites I go to, with similar goals as caedes.net and there comments such as those two by me (which are probably my nastiest two so far) would be nothing out of the ordinary. Not justifying anything, just telling how it is...

And one more thing, I really do usually make more thoughtful comments, those two are just not my finest work. :(

And in future, there is no repercussion to not responding to "Comment Requests." You may ignore them if you wish.

Yes, I often ignore CRs, but sometimes I just can't help myself. ;)

I will send you a PM with the link.

I have not communicated any of this with the members in question ... and for that reason never supplied the links on this thread.

Granted, quoting here was not totally anonymous, but I tried to use some tact and discretion. I hope you see my point, as I do enjoy your work and when you are able and time permitting ... can see how others could benefit from your expertise.

And sincerely ... thank you Miran. Maybe it was just an off day for you ... hey, it happens to all of us.

It seems that honest critiques are not sometimes wanted.I am thinking of a work where it is mundane and looks like a snapshot.BUT because the author is well liked here, his work is sometimes overvalued; I told him the work was ordinary. I then see immediately after my comment, glowing comments about how marvelous this image is.BULL! It is not and I would think an honest appraisal would be more valued than kissing someone's behind out of friendship.Doing so leads to the impression that the work is not being evaluated-rather the photographer is more important.
This phenomenon is quite common here...I see many photos which are ordinary (and, no, it would not be just my taste at work here-.they would be seen as plain in most people's eyes, I think) and their c-index is much too high when compared with the images that deserve the higher ratings.
I personally do not like to be told my work is good or bad dependent on how popular I am.
The integrity of the work is what matters to me.

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

Mundaneness could be too.

theay whath...

*unties tongue over the "m" word Lyn used*

ahem... yeah, what she said.. :oP

I totally agree with DERAIN! I often see comments such as "Awesome shot. 10/10", when in fact it is obviously very plain and barely deserves a 3/10. Sometimes this happens because of these "friendhips relations", sometimes because some people simply put the bar very low and sometimes because the first couple of comments are for some reason extremely "positive" and then everyone else just goes along with the flow.

I don't have a problem with that though, it's just that sometimes it's difficult for me to decide whether to leave a comment or not. Perhaps a simple solution would be to add an option to state the reason why you're uploading every image as you upload. You could have a few options, something like

Why are you uploading this image?

(a) to get constructive criticism in order to learn and improve
(b) to impress my friends
(c) no reason / because I was bored

This selection would then appear at every image's page. That way people would have an easier time deciding whether or not to comment. For example if something was posted "to impress my friends", I would know not to leave a comment containing constructive criticism...

Awesome is a word I never use, but I have said Great shot 10/10 (on very rare occassions, I do not often vote 10's) and I say it because that is what I think, never because the person is a "friend". As I said before, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and what may seem 'plain' to some could easily be something that is seen differently by another. I have posted about how I vote, how I break it down, elsewhere, and I am sure there are as many methods of reaching a voting decision as there are voters. If the comments are upsetting anyone I suggest they dont read them, they should not influence the content of our own opinions.
The idea of stating a reason for uploading could be a good thing but I find (b) quite objectionable, and (c) little better.

As I've said before, I always leave constructive criticism if I feel its warranted and I cannot remember ever getting negative feedback about this. I do the same thing on Deviant Art and I have had nothing but positive responses there too, so it isn't simply due to my position or "popularity". If you are getting negative responses to feedback you have left I would suggest that you are probably not being very tactfull... it's quite easy to be honest without being rude...

While I agree w/Sam on the above, I've never gotten a negative response to constructive criticism, and I do think it's all in the way you say it, there was also this idea. (A better thought out version in my personal opinion)

As a painter and photgrapher who exhibits in galleries, I have heard the gamut of feedback: from it's all wonderfull, no matter what I did, to, It's terrible; the truth is much of my art is valued as good, a few, great and fewer, banal. I appreciate the truth(consensus) and so take an average of what is said about my work;this way, I come to a clearer understanding of the value of my art. Unfortunately, on this site, I have had some of my photos judged as pretty awful when they have sold well. My conclusion?? I am not one the clique, the popular.
For, Lyn: there is such a thing as mundane-the ordinary is its usual defintion-which connotes neither especially good or bad. Definitions exist for a reason: they mean something and are man's best attempt at conveying an internal state with verbal abilities.
Yes, there are sometimes works which are seen by some as good, by others, as not.and.......There ARE WORKS WHICH THE MAJORITY WOULD TERM "ORDINARY"; I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO EMPLOY ITS USAGE, AS I, LIKE ALL OF YOU,HAVE THE SKILL TO MAKE THAT DETERMINATION; IT IHAS BEEN USED ON MY WORK TOO.

Derain: I agree with you about the comments.. that has been going on for years.. I even deliberately posted a really bad piece of work and I still got "great work" "love it" etc.. I think too that people hold back on critics because there are quite a few artists on here who think their work is great, and will not accept any help, tips or suggestions, they are quite aggressive and message the commenter... Personally if I think something needs fixing i will advise them on how to improve it.. As for comments on photos, I think a lot of the judging comes from members who are just starting out and still have a lot to learn or are hobby photographers... we do have some professional photographers on here who will give great advice when you ask them.. to me if your work is selling very well and you get good feedback from outside here, thats all that matters, you know that its good..
I agree too that there have been some very "ordinary" pieces of work that have glowing comments and high scores while others who have gone the "extra mile" and have actually thought about the pic they are taking have few comments and low scores.. I think it could be because a lot on here dont look at the creativity of a photo, they look at the colours, if its pretty etc.. it's worse for the fractalists who have blatantly been told so many times on their work "i dont like it because i dont know anything about this kind of art"

Miran: I have said that over and over again about why people are uploading images.. I ask all the time "when you first became a member of Caedes and you uploaded your first images.. did you know about comments, c-index and voting?... NO.. you posted on here to share your work, and get helpful tips and suggestions on how to improve".. Its funny how after a few months people start changing and think that the figures and comments are the all important part of their art... yes the comments are good and it gives you a boost to do more art, but members should also take the bad with the good.. Personally if someone says to me they dont like it.. I always send a message and thank them for their comment and what is it they dont like about it so I can improve it... negativity on work can be a good thing, it pushes you to do better...

Extremely well said J_272004//I can add nothing...........let's all take a real look at a photo and judge it on its merit.........criticism is assumed to be a "bad" thing.it ought to be critique,perhaps, as that can denote a sense of evaluation on composition,perspective,lighting,tonal qualities,mood, etc.

I'm frankly tired of certain people trying to drill it into everyone else's head why they are here or why they are not here. It's condescending to say the least . . . Have the courtesy to allow each person to determine for him or herself what brought them here and what makes them stay....

Yes, I'm here to share, but I'm also here to participate in the "system." The "system" here most definately hypes a "random" rating system in which images are viewed and rated by other members. To suggest that people shouldn't care about ratings that grossly underrate the quality of certain images or types of images simply goes against what we all know to be true - - it's simply NATURAL to find such ratings troublesome or offensive. I used to regularly post fractals here as they were quite well received. That simply ceases to be the case. My last two fractal uploads now sit with c-indexes in the 30s. I've stopped analyzing why as, with the advent of the new voting system, fractals uniformly receive substandard votes here. Nonetheless, I feel little incentive to share fractal work here under the circumstances and it goes without saying that there are MANY other fractal artists, some of whom are still here and some of whom have moved to "friendlier" forums, who feel much the same way. Wen

As I said Wendy.. that is my opinion and I am NOT being condescending thankyou very much... I do allow people to say what or why they came here and why they stay.. that is their choice... as is my choice to say what I feel.. (yes it upsets people how I feel but that is my choice, my opinon and I AM allowed to have one like everyone else)... all i am saying is that when people first posted on Caedes was that the reason why? was it because they wanted to share and enjoy their work or was it for the ratings... its a simple question.. and I'm sorry you feel offended by it as it's not meant to be.. There are more things in this life besides arguing, stressing and getting upset because of it... If you feel that your work is being put down because of the "C" word, go out into the real world.. take some of your work to a local gallery and get a professional critic on it.. i know from experience that they will be happy to look at it and give an honest opinion.. as for "friendlier" forums it depends on your attitude and friendliness to others no matter what forum you are on...

And another thing.. I take OFFENCE to being put down everytime I don't agree with something and have my say... so take that as you will it will more than likely sound "Condescending" as I have been told a few times by you...

My play on this irreconcilable difficulty is that Caedes is full of an enormous variety of people - from professional photographers or media people - and artists in different media - to those who have a mobile telephone (only) and snap pictures. I always feel I am the kiss of death when I really love an image (be it real or computer generated by an artist) - because when I see the score they get, it is invariably low. I realise now that it is the artist in me (yes I paint/pastel/sketch as well) which seems to be the difference. I'm not saying something is wonderful because of the person - or the medium - it is because something appeals to my sense of 'art', composition, use of colour, imagination and other aesthetic qualities I find in a piece of work.
In my photography 'grain' doesn't necessarily matter! If the imagination and composition is there - the 'grain' might even be a bonus. Of course there are digital purists who would mark me down or ridicule me for this aberration! My gallery contains scores from about 19 - 76. Two have recently gone into the photography gallery. Strangely enough, although these two were 'popular', they are not ones I take particular pride in!
What I am trying to say is - if I want to appreciate art in a convivial atmosphere, I'll visit a gallery or specialist outlet. If I want chat - I'll visit a chatroom. I am fully aware of the clique - the great wonders of Caedes - and I'll never be one, but it has been nice sharing some of my work - although critiques have been few and far between - I am too shy to ask for one - seems so pretentious!!
If you like chocolates - you don't necessarily like cheese - c'est la vie!

Re: above-this is wonderfully said; I thank you for adding a varied and wise critique....enough said.Alain

Hi Kate -it is a shame you see participating in 'request for comment' as pretentious. I do not see it that way at all and I think it is a pity that this avenue of gaining insight into our own efforts is not used more often. Both times I have sought help there I have received generous and wise help both publicly and privately. I found it a humbling experience.
Pretentious has several definitions. I do not like any of them. If you think that way, maybe others do also. I do not mind putting my efforts up for extra scrutiny, but I will think twice about seeking help that way from now on, and maybe do it behind the scenes. Shame really, because that way no one else benefits from the replies.

p.s. I really do not think my lack of participation in any other art media should preclude me from being able to see the artistry in an image here. I dont make jewellery either but can recognise a beautiful piece. I do not create sunsets, but can recognise a splendid one of those as well.

Eve, you just keep doing what you're doing. it would be a hard sell and a far stretch to call you "pretentious". perhaps that dagger was tossed in another's direction...

Eve.. keep using the request thread.. thats how we learn, and everytime someone gives you advice it IS helping others especially the ones who WANT to improve.. i wouldnt let what one person has said put you off.. they obviously dont want to improve and learn...

As for the "lack of participation in other media" thats a weak excuse... anyone with eyes can see whether they like the look of something, just because they dont "create" that kind of art does NOT mean they can't appreciate the beauty and creativity..

"just because they dont "create" that kind of art does NOT mean they can't appreciate the beauty and creativity.. "
-------

and this coming from a fractalist..how true :P hehehehe

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr your gonna be sorry for that comment... be warned.. *lmao..

:o) yeah yeah yeah...*yawn*

*smacks Rob upside the head* .. Bummer, no damage.

Eve, ..I agree with Jacqueline. Using the Request For Comment is anything but pretentious to me. How can asking for help ever be that ? No, I think it's a great way to ask for help if necessary & possibly help others in the bargain. So I don't think anyone should be leery of using that feature here.

hahahaha at least i can walk in a yard without tripping, Queen o the corn :P

*sticks foot out ... trips Rob.. hmmm what was that about tripping... ohh look you had a soft landing in the mud.. shhhh stop complaining.. its good for your face... hehehehehe

ah, softmud...you're right. it IS good for facials...*smooshes a healthy glob of it in Jaq's face, hair, and elsewhere*

puh!!! mumble mumble... tastes gritty.. =PP wooohoooo mud fight... splat!! in Robs face..=PP

:)
Mud, mud, glorious mud
Nothing quite like it for cooling the blood
So follow me follow, down to the hollow
And there let me wallow in glorious mud
:)

LMAO...

Jacqueline responded...."...all i am saying is that when people first posted on Caedes was that the reason why?..."

Sorry, Jacqueline, but that is NOT all you have been saying. To the contrary, as you stated above:
"....I have said that over and over again about why people are uploading images.. I ask all the time 'when you first became a member of Caedes and you uploaded your first images.. did you know about comments, c-index and voting?... NO.. you posted on here to share your work, and get helpful tips and suggestions on how to improve'.. Its funny how after a few months people start changing and think that the figures and comments are the all important part of their art..."

You aren't just asking people why they are here....you're TELLING them and then faulting them for no longer being here for the reasons you ascribe to them. That's what I find condescending. As for the " OFFENCE [you take] to being put down everytime [you] don't agree with something," that is just not the case. I'm simply saying that I find it offensive that you repeatedly insist on telling others why they should be here. I have no problem with you sharing why YOU are here.

Again...."I'M here to share, but I'm also here to participate in the "system." The "system" here most definately hypes a "random" rating system in which images are viewed and rated by other members. To suggest that people shouldn't care about ratings that grossly underrate the quality of certain images or types of images simply goes against what [IMHO] we all know to be true - - it's simply NATURAL to find such ratings troublesome or offensive." Wen

*rolls eyes* and so it goes, and so it goes. where it's going, noone knows...

I AM NOT telling people why they should be here.. try reading it properly... I give up trying to have my opinion on here.. I am wasting my time it seems as you are ALWAYS right and everyone is wrong with their opinions... I have a right to ask people why they came to this site and all I am trying to do is to put all this s*** that keeps getting brought up over and over again into perspective in other words (just incase I dont make myself clear and sound offensive or condescending) try to get people to look back and see why they came on here in the first place.. THAT my dear is not telling them why they came its a QUESTION and if you find someone asking a question offensive you have problems...
I'm not saying that the ratings are not unfair If you bothered to read what I wrote instead of jumping down my throat I said "I agree too that there have been some very "ordinary" pieces of work that have glowing comments and high scores while others who have gone the "extra mile" and have actually thought about the pic they are taking have few comments and low scores.."

my opinion if it was me who finds this site so troublesome and so offensive.. I would leave find a different site.. or even make my own so that its run the way I want it to... why stay if its such an unhappy, stressful, unfair place....

Anyway.. i'm finished with this.. as i've said i'm wasting my time and i'm being soooo offensive..... so while i'm been offensive and condescending.. here's one to curl your toes "Get over it or move on!!!"... hows that for rude and offensive (may as well make it worthwhile)... =) have a nice day

*looks over shoulder for Piner's elephant gun and the bosses long arm to drag this into the hall of shame ... lol

Why I came here: I came here on a recommendation from a friend to find high quality high res desktop wallpapers back when I bought a 20" LCD with 1600x1200 resolution and needed wallpapers of that size. I found many good ones and so decided to give something in return. So I uploaded a few wallpapers of my own. Not very high quality I admit, but over the past few months I learned quite a bit and improved my skills at making photographic desktop wallpapers and I think I still have a lot of room for improvement. I'll stay and upload more for as long as I get helpful comments from all the nice people here that make it possible for me to learn and improve. I understand that some people have reached a higher plane of existance and produce such high quality masterpieces twice a day that they don't ever need anyone to tell them how to make them better (because they're perfect), but those are very few and far between. And as I'm not one of those people I still appreciate any and all tips and insightful comments people give and in my naivity expect most others who are in the same boat as me to feel the same. Of course I realize now I'm wrong about that...

Zyzzyva - a tropical American weevil

Yes it is a wonderful place to learn and improve i had never attempted fractals until I came on here.. as for photography I only took snap shots now I look at everything differently... I am still learning and always listen to all the helpful advice..

I'm so glad Miran that you are one of the few who like and listen to suggestions and tips, it is the only way to improve and learn and believe me its a never ending journey there is always something new.. =)

I think the majority of us are sailing in the same boat as Miran - some of us are sailing a bit slower than others but so long as we all enjoy the journey that is good. While it is very encouraging and helpful to receive advice, help and suggestions ( that is the only way to improve, and I love getting that sort of comment) it must not be forgotten that the odd nice word, just saying "hello, I enjoyed your picture" can also make a day better than it was.
As to why did I first come here ? I followed a link on another site for 'nice wallpapers' and now I am trapped, addicted, and loving every second of it. The fact that my family think I have taken leave of my senses, forever asking for the car to be stopped, pointing out various scenes and commenting on 'the wonderful light' ( I like to sound as though I know what I am talking about even when I don't lol) is beside the point, they will just have to get used to it.

*Polishing up the elephant gun* :c)

w00t !!! ... Last Post ...

Nope... I got last post... *shoves Keifer outta the way*

:oP

So you might think.

*trips Curt on his way to post last*

Ohh, that's gonna leave a mark. *grins impishly*

Nellie the Elephant packed her trunk
And said goodbye to the circus
Off she went with a trumpety-trump
Trump, trump, trump
Nellie the Elephant packed her trunk
And trundled back to the jungle
Off she went with a trumpety-trump
Trump, trump, trump

The head of the herd was calling
Far, far away
They met one night in the silver light
On the road to Mandalay
So Nellie the Elephant packed her trunk
And said goodbye to the circus
Off she went with a trumpety-trump
Trump, trump, trump


She took her camera with her . . . . .

Good one Eve!! I love it! ;=)

Hey... no fair picking on a guy with only one leg... *shakes fist at Les*

shouldn't that be...*shakes leg*?

Keifer... Curt... Les... no one seemed to notice, but I already got the last word in...

*pats Sam on the head* well, that matters more to some, than to others...

I can not respond 'cos I am on the road to Mandalay - escaping the elephant gun

Trumpety trump

Well Sam ... I didn't want to ... ahem point out other people's mistakes ... but ... you be wrong. Check this out:

Zzzyzxensis: Part of Apolysis zzyzxensis, a bombyliid fly (named for the Desert Studies Area on Zzyzx Road).

*smiles smugly*

*waits for the Apophysis joke that is coming* ... and it is ... er, will ... uhm ... maybe?

Question: how do you pronounce Apophysis?

ah, but which Apophysis? the one predicting the end of the world? (waits)

OK Les... how about "Zzzzzzzz: The sound Sam makes when he reads threads like this one..."

;-)

Drats.

Foiled by the Ozzie Wiz of Wit, once again.

I'll get you back !!

*shakes fist at Sam* ... releases die ... rolls a seven !!! I win !!!