At the risk of being dropped on from a great height – I was curious as to what degree people here perceive the obvious improvement in overall quality of submitted photographs is down to increased ability of the operator or the massive advances in inbuilt technology in the cameras. Certainly in point and shoot models now they seam to do everything but make the tea whereas some SLR models are moving away from gimmick driven presets to rely more on operator input. It’s just a thought I would like people to consider and discuss rather than getting all bent out of shape as usual. Or - worded slightly more diplomatically – how many people believe they have personally improved their skill levels as a result of input from the site?

My skills have definitely improved as a result of being a member here but technology is a large contributory factor also. I started out with a Fujifilm F-11 compact and the shots were pretty good but now that I have an SLR the quality has improved quite dramatically. Not so much the composition as that's entirely down to the user but the actual image quality is a lot better. While I was a compact owning member I paid particular note to what camera was used to capture my favourite shots from the site and almost exclusively it was down to the use of an SLR.

I do.

I know without any doubt that constant feedback from Caedes members has helped me to improve my camera craft over the last few years.

As for modern camera technology. I think it allows new shooters to get pretty good photos without too much effort, especially in the point and shoot class. I think that it has improved the standard of photos that we are getting on Caedes.

I think that the same technology and automation can be a limiting factor because many people rely on it to get their photos and never get around to learning how to drive their camera… so to speak. The result being that some / many people reach a reasonable standard quickly then don’t make any further progress.

The sheer amount of digital trickery running behind the scenes is pretty scary :Image Stabilization, Twilight Modes, High Definition, Face Detection, Built In Infrared, D-Max Compensation, In Camera Retouch, Multiple Scene Mode Presets (as many as two dozen sometimes), Noise Reduction, Auto Tracking Focus etc etc leading you to think what else is there left to do. Definitely a help for beginners but also, as has been mentioned, ultimately a hindrance too. Especially when people forget that it is actually going on and hit a wall on their progression. It’s good to see that some of the more obscure manufacturers have started releasing very barebones models that completely eschew most if not all of this digital enhancement technology.

After almost 5 years on the site, I must say that the general quality of the uploads is growing up constantly.
I think that discussions about the rules, the composition or about the manipulation or the postprocessing is really enriching.
On the other side, the reduction of the prices of the entry-level dSLRs makes that many people can buy one. It's a very good way to improve the classic techniques in photography.
Before the numeric age, I owned a Nikon F70. I began in numeric with a little HP 715. Nothing to do, just to aim and take the photo... ;-)
I found my feelings again with the dSLR.

I think you can see marked improvements in a long list of the photographers here .. the longer they stay, keep an open mind about their art&vision they will be evolving as artists

what started as a personal hobby of 'snapping pictures' has grown to 'creating art' and 'presenting art' .. and, perhaps for some, thinking of themselves as artists .. and the group community atmosphere has nurtured that

I've heard this expression on TV .. and I'm not sure if it applies here .. but we are "friends with benefits"

:o)

I think a really good photo has a great deal to do with composition. No matter how snazzy your camera s, it ain't gonna help with that. not yet, anyway...

Personally I think the improvement in my own photography is a bit of both. In my case I don't think it's so much advanced technology as the lenses that I have now. Certainly a good macro lens makes taking interesting and good looking phtos easier. Also I think the larger resolution, which means I can crop half the photo out and still have a 1600x1200 image left is a plus... however I usually find that my original composition/framing looks best anyway (that's why I framed it that way in the first place).

In any case I think that even if I was using the same camera as I had when I was 12 my photos now would still be better than they were when I started on this site. Practice makes perfect as they say... OK, in my case, "Practice makes better". As far as the overall site goes, I think the increase in quality photos probably has alot to do with the sites increasing reputation. There are still tons of crappy photos out on the web (just go somewhere like DA, there are pages of them), I think that this site encourages quality more than someother sites do and probably discourages lazy, pointless snapshots, not totally but moreso than other sites. Also I think the amount of helpful feedback on this site, which again is much more than any other I have seen, helps people to improve more quickly, and the large number of good photographers that are here long term helps encourage people to improve (ie to try to live up to the standard).

I don't think camera technology has improved to a degree that it makes a bad photographer take good photos...

Me, me, me!! I feel like the site and awesome people here have really helped me improve!! Thanks to all & to Master Caedes for such a great place to play & explore!!

I have two P&S, I rarely use any of the "in camera" junk, and it's got a ton; snow, fireworks, green punch, etc., etc. I normally shoot in P or portrait and do most all my macro stuff on my smaller P&S Elph. I use PS7 and always check / correct my levels & curves then resize. If I manip, it's usually pretty heavy and / or give it a frame to hide something on the fringe of the shot.

Just seeing all the different post here has really opened up my eyes and mind...I see something someone post and think, "hey", that's neat and then try to recreate what they did some how. I try to plan out my shots more than when I started 1 1/2 years ago and sometimes I switch to M mode tryin' to learn all that f-stop & shutter speed stuff just by playin' and taking notes.

I feel like I learn or get something from the site and wonderful people here almost on a daily basis!!

Cheers to all!!

I still like the manual selector Phil. Does that mean I still have hope for myself?

yes.

:-)

To be honest, I think that digital cameras(DCs) in general have made it "easy" to take a picture and have it turn out looking ok. In some respects I think that DCs have made more people want to take pictures but at the same time DCs have made it so the "photographers" understanding of exposure, aperature and iso have be numbed if not altogether not-learned-what-so-ever.

It's great that more people have an interest in photography due to DCs. It's just that I think there is something to be said for fully manual film cameras. I think that in today's DC population (so to speak), many so called "photographers" do not have an understanding of the basics (exposure, aperature and iso).

So, yes, the technology of DCs is great, and yes it is good that more people are interested in photography because of it. But I wonder if this technology has "dumbed down" (sorry, I hate using that word, dumb) photography as a whole?

Yes - i'd agree with that completely.

Me too... How many people know the link between aperture and DoF?
However, many DCs (thanks Canuck!) got settings with 'aperture priority'. You could take a first photo at f=3,5 and a second at f=11 and directly see the difference on your monitor...
And it's free!!!

I think it is wonderful that the technology has afforded people the opportunity to take better photos, but I think there are many more people buying digital cameras (point and shoot variety) to get photos of their families and celebrations, etc. There is also a segment of digital camera owners who have been drawn to photography as a hobby and can now better afford to pursue that hobby because there is no expense for film and dark room supplies or prcessing fees and they can take multiple shots of things and not have to wait for the results to come back from the photo lab. Some of these hobbyists have a genuine interest in learning about the possiblities of creating different moods or affects with the use of f-stop, aperture, ISO, etc. I am one of the latter. I have learned from books and experimentation and from the people on this site. My ability has impoved in the year I have been on Caedes (at least I think it has) and I bought a dSLR because of that interest three months after joining the site. I bought a Canon D350 and the kit lens and have been saving my pennies for another lens and wracking my brain about which one to get. I am probably going to buy the Tamron 18-250mm or the Sigma 18-200mm OS when it is released and better reviewed. I think you can do some great stuff with the auto mode on most cameras, but for the challenge, manual setting are fun and worth utilizing. I'm still learning and someday I'm going to purchase another non-dSLR just to carry around with me. In many instances photos are perfect as they come from the camera, but there are times when using software allows you to expand your creative side or just enhance a photo enough that it represents the subject just as you saw it. Oh,when I went over to Flickr and checked out their Camera Finder link, I was surprised to find that dSLRs head the lists of most popular cameras. So technology and lowered cost have helped more people to pursue an interest in photography and there will always be those who are fascinated by the use of manual setting and those who don't and they can both create beautiful photographs and art. I even considered taking a 10 month course in photography at the Hallmark School of Photography in Turner's Falls, MA until I learned that the cost of the education was over $31,000! I guess I'll have to keep experimenting!

I feel that the technology in the digital cameras today has somewhat taken the imagination of the user away.

The challenges and joys of photography is to explore, learn and to create a stunning photograph.
I feel that there has been so much lost in the area of on site creativity and understanding of the art. Now it just take a setting and your of and running.

I do know that it takes a certain eye to create a really good photo and a talent to create an exceptional photo.

Adams did not just walk out into the Sierras and take a picture, he learned and made mistakes.
I think that framing, depth and esthetic value are still important in an image.

im curious as to how long it will take for them to include some sort of dynamic focus/dof functions using the same technology as the face detection software - i wouldnt have thought it is that far off but in the wise words of the great sage jeff goldblum - 'they were so preoccupied with whether or not they could that they didn't stop to think if they should'....

don't cameras do that now with bracketing? I'm fairly certain my Olympus can do a sequence of different focal lengths on the same shot, or are you referring to something else?

something else :-)

My Digital Rebel XT comes with an A-Dep setting. It averages out the DOF in a picture so that it overall looks "right". Don't ask me how it does it though, I've got no clue. I think it's mainly for group portraits.

Just to add to the mix... many P&S have Av and Tv settings but how many people that buy actually use them / understand how to use them? My guess is not too many...

related to the dof/aperture thing, just a step up in difficulty ;-) ....

If you can note the difference between the D50 and D70...wait wait...if you can tell the difference between the Lumix DMC L1 and Digilux 3...you're good.

Don't be ashamed; i don't even know.

more money


As for the Tech Vs Ability, personally I like the feel and control I have with my old Mamiya SLR. The way the controls function compared to my Digital Rebel are better IMO, with having the aperture control on the barrel of the lens. It took me a long time when I got my DC to get used to it's new-fangledness scroll wheel and buttons. I've had it for near a year and I still don't know all that it can do! Sometimes I think simpler is better. Give me a fully manual DC with aperture control on the lens barrel and I'd be happy as a peach!

Well I have learnt heaps here at Caedes, thanks to the generosity of members. I now know DOF is not Daft Old Fool, and I know a bit about exposure, and apertures, and a few other bits and bobs. PSP has become my friend.
However, I still p & s in the main. Like the person who has two speeds, dead slow and stop, I use two settings, P (whatever that is, auto something or other) and Macro.
I think I am too old to learn all the other stuff so I am thankfull for what my camera does for me, especially image stabilization. Probably means I will never improve. I should have started years ago before I became a DOF.

Too old ?!? Impossible... ! :-)