As i sit there whittling the hours of the day away I find myself in a void. In this void I find myself thinking about quite strange things. One of the things I think most about is religion. This is not going to be another one of those posts that I usually post that I imagine most of you cringe at the thought of. Instead I think I should post a thread about school. I personally think that the education system as a whole has failed and promotes stupidity in exchange for athletic talent.

-School hates me therefore I hate it.

I like that quote...I think I got a fairly good education, however, there are some major glitches in the school system. Too much emphasis is put on athletics, true, but on the other hand, too much emphasis is put on grades--not the actual knowledge that is gained. Students learn how to get good grades, not learn, and therefore struggle later on when the get into the real world and find out they can't B.S. their way through life...

First I have a question. Which quote? There are two. Another thing is that schools in the united states are straining too much to earn more government funding, hence the massive outbreak of ADD in 1998. Every day attendence is taken not to ensure as many people are getting educated as possible but to boast that they can get more funding because of the number of warm bodies on the school grounds.
I, myself, don't believe that scholarships should be awarded for athletic ability. At least not for college. That is the greatest problem in colleges today. Too many jocks. ( If you can't tell I don't like jocks and they don't like me. )

I like "school hates me therefore I hate it". I also think ADD is a load of bull. It is just that kids are energetic--they're supposed to be; they're kids! However, teacher's have decided they don't want to deal with these energetic kids, and put them on medication...it is ver dangerous to drug up children (how do we know that ridelin isn't like cigarrettes or alcohol--in that they are addictive?). True, schools put a lot of emphasis on government funding...but that is because they don't have money, and need it to teach kids.

I think schools should put more emphasis on knowledge and less on sports...many schools are cutting many programs like art and music, but dump all their money into their atletics...grrr!

Also, colleges should pay their football players more...they get nearly as much attention as professional leagues, and they get paid the bare minimum...not very nice since that's where most of the colleges' money is coming from...

Colleges get most of their money from students who are paying their dues not athletics. I'll believe this unless you can prove otherwise.

when i was in school most of the class time was spent with the teachers getting onto the trouble makers, i always had loads of homework becuase class time was not spent wisely and blah blah blah. i dropped out of school in the 8th grade, when i was 16 i went and took my Ged test, i passed everything well with the exception of math (which i have never been good at no matter what,lol) i then took classes for about 8 weeks in math, then went and passed the whole GED exam, i then enrolled in University and took some general education courses. so, i got to college faster than my classmates, and i feel they didn't really learn much more than me, and others that i knew who dropped out in like 10th or 11th grade took the test more times than i did and still failed, yet they supposedly got more education than i did. personally i am going to homeschool my child.
as for the ADD subject, think about it, 20 to 30 years ago kids got more exercise, they didn't have so many video games, computers, and such things. they played outside. I have a nephew who is labeled ADHD, he lives in a big city in a tiny basement apartment with practically no yard and spends most of his time indoors watching tv or playing video games.
i agree about sports too, i played volleball and basketball in jr high and i loved it, but they do put way to much emphasis on it.

That's an interesting theory you have.

YEESSS YOUR MY HERO~~~!!!! DUDE YOUR SOOOO RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THATS MY OPINON EXACTLY!!!! also i think the whole Grades system is deeply flawed...because moron jock kids get strait a's and i (who have been marked Gifted by the school board) hardly scrape by...its just flawed...it needs refinment

I graduated last spring, and I should let you in on a little secret...don't hate the jock kids because either (a) they are definately not going to be the same way they are now after they graduate (b) they will freak out when they get into the real world and won't be able to support themselves--too much of a change from high school... or (c) they will be jerks forever, will not have changed by your reunions, and will then only have failed relationships because they cannot change.

Same here as Otaku; I just failed a Chemistry class while a complete idiot jock got a 30% higher grade than I did, who worked equally as hard. WTF?
Another flaw is teachers themselves. They are only there b/c they contain information used to educate, regardless of their background on mental stability. Heck, my former Algebra teacher was a recovered crack addict, and my computer teacher has an emotional disorder. They also like to bring their private lives with them to school and act like asses to the people who are innocent. It's just not right b/c we are the ones that have to take the short end of the stick.

Wow... You guys make me feel better about me retarded teachers.
I still hate jocks though. You can't change my mind about that.

One simple fact I have learned is you take away from school what you want to learn. High school can only be good if you take some time and try to learn a little on your own and challenge yourself. Also don't blame the teachers my mother is a substitute they don't have it so easy either, I mean we all know how many troublemakers there are out there. It is true about the teachers teaching to the tests and too much empahasis on athletics. It's better in college, those two points anyway.

I really don't want to touch a sensitive subject but all the substitues I have ever had were just paid baby-sitters. Maybe I've just had most of the bad subs. Don't get me wrong some of them were really good at what they did and even had a degree in the subject for which they were subbing. I once had a PE sub teach my Adv. Trig class.

by the way raptor, nice job on putting out the interesting topics, both here and on the other threads...:D

I agree, I've been through school and mainly that is what they(subs) are and even sadder it's what they're paid for. The schools would rather you do that well firstly than anything else. This brings up the two things I wish would happen:
1) Schooling was not seen as so mandatory in the eyes of the schools, if a kid is an interuption take him/her out...he/she doesn't want to learn. If they want to screw up there lives and have no education so be it.
2) Only teachers who cared about teaching, the students, and the subject they are teaching should be used.

I don't know if I agree with you, rus. I struggled through school until about 7th grade. I never did my homework, and just barely got past the 6th grade. I almost flunked! However, I straightened out my act, and I was able to graduate with High Honors. If we went with your plan, than that probably never would have happened.

I do see your point, though. I know tons of kids I went to school with that were nothing but a distraction. Perhaps we could have two separate schools: one for the kids who wanted to learn, and one for those that only wanted to horse around... Perhaps it would be so much of an embarassment that the kids would shape up.

On second thought, that's not a very good idea either. I guess we just need to take it with a grain of salt--and know that it's not perfect. I do very much agree with your second to last post, however. You learn what you want to. You have to open your mind to your teachers, or they'll never get in. School is what you make of it.

great post raptor. okay i have Major home work problems... i cant get at all motivated i am in 8th grade and am getting pretty close to failing. last year i had an a in history... which would be just a crazy idea for me now because of my teacher. it would help if he didnt talk about how much the "outside" world sucked. also he doesnt seem to want to help the students and hes only there to waste away the hours for his paycheck. the good teachers are the ones that you can tell want to see you do good and who motivate you, like my last year history teacher.
alright as for the two differnt schools proposal... i think that itd probably be better to just have the one school and give those kids the opportunity to turn around and get the good teachers. no improvement can be made if they just sit at their school and goof off... sorta defeats the purpous. and thats y kids drop out.
my life skills teacher made a proposition about homework... she sugest that you not be graded by if you do your homework but by what you learn from it. as long as you grasp the concept of your work then you dont necessarily have to complete it, and this would be quite a nice change for schools if they started looking a bit more in that direction.
and lastly on the subjects of subs... i once had a sub and all he did was sit there messing on his lap top after telling one of my classmates to pass out the papers on his desk...

Here's what I think is the largest problem with the education system that they have right now. To many classes are required to graduate from high school and college. Fine Art is an great example. I can see the point of a well rounded education but in my eyes it really does nothing fo the individuals future life. This may not be true for some extreme cases but for the most part it seem to be true. It's already too full of people who are taking just for the sake of taking it but just sit there with their thumbs up their inappropriate orifice.
As with history, okay, I see the whole "don't repeat history" deal but history is just a collection of people's actions that someone thought was important enough to write down and even then it isn't right 30 percent of the time.
Most of the time it's the teacher. Even more frequently it's because of "experimental teaching methods." You know, those teaching methods that seem only half baked and the results come back 10-12 years later and they find out that it doesn't work and they have permanently screwed up a group of kids they decided to test it on.
An even worse part is that often it is too early in the morning to go to school and it's all because of sports. When I query about it they say, "We can't push back the schedule because of sport. If we started even an hour later we wouldn’t be able to play the games appropriately, " That made NO sense to me at all so I've given up asking.
Another problem is that, often teachers are required to teach specific thing that could be better spent learning something else. Example one: In an English class I was forced to take we were going to read novels such as Tom and Huck but the NEA in all of its wisdom decides that, no, we are going to read a 600 page gray book with various short stories with in my opinion have no point.
I'm done for today. I'll write more tomorrow.

Now Jessiac, I'm curious to what changed things around for you; almost failing? parental intervention? Fear of being kicked out and losing your friendships? If it's the latter than proposition 1 (he he, I sound like a politician) would remedy the situation...
I agree there are too many requirements in classes, although the point of primary and high schools is to try to figure out what you want to do later in life; you can't do that if you don't know about your options. My high school was pretty good with the problem of keeping people who didn't want to be there out of classes at least some of the time; we had a work-study program that if you wished(could drive and had parent approval) you could work instead of taking classes as long as you had already or were taking the required classes. I though it worked well anyway... Oh and school being later, you really don't want that, because if it's later you have no time to do do anything fun afterwards.
As for you phoenix, stay with it, stupid teachers and all, sometimes sadly you have to take the initiative and learn the stuff yourself (I know, one year I had to, I ended up teaching half the class(the half who cared) one year)

I want to get out later. We get up at 5:00 and school ends at 2:30.
In my opinion thats too early. I'm not a morning person. I would be happy If it were pushed back an hour.

5:00!! Bugger that... god I am so glad I don't have to go to school anymore... BTW anyone who tells you that school is the best time of you life etc, I don't agree with that. There are so many great experiences to be had afterwards.

I wouldn't know.

5:00 wow... thats crazy i have to get up at 7 but im not a morning person at all its a horrible occasion waking up in the morning. I havnt made it into high school yet but its probably better than where we're at now. Except we have to go to Freshman Acadamy. which is bs but who knows maybe teaming and seperating people really does help your education <in all honesty actually> alrighty as for high school and all the test...
Living in Ohio we have to take the Ohio Graduation test in our sophmore year. If you dont pass this test you are held back. End of story. ... now there might be a problem with this as someone might just be having a bad day or something or get really nervous on test. i dont think this is fair as a straight a high honor student all their lives could be held back because of only one test. permanent record degrades and everything. horrible situation, also the test is mostly essay. if you arnt good at liturature and english... will your not good at anything else according to these test. memorizing formulas and constant practicing of math really doesnt seem like it would come in handy in latter life... i mean i really could careless as to what the hell i hypotonuse is. school does teach some useless things. as for history... its good to get the basics as to how our government was formed but to know everything about every single battle... will if u ask me its rather a boring talking point to discuss the battle of shiloh but that might be just me. i found computers class to be the most useful in "real-life" situations even though it is considered an elective and not incredibly important. computers are taking over, everything is digitalized now adays. alrighty i think thats enough ranting for me... g'night

I had a cousin who was doing well all through school and getting really high grades... then when she got to her final year exams she became very ill and had to miss them. Then she had to wait a whole year before she could sit them again, it really screwed things up for her. My opinion is that having the result 12 years of education come down to 6 or 7 finals is outrageous. It's just not an accurate way to gauge someones acedemic ability...

In washington there is a similar test. It's a non-standardized test that is becoming almost as important as the SATs. It's really all a load of manure because the answer is not what is graded the process to arrive at the answer is. So say the question is find the mean weight a tobogganing team (acctual question). The person who can see it in their head and answers the question with no work recieves a zero or rarely a plus one. The person sitting next to the oter person doodles the tobagganing team and doesn't even arrive at the correct answer recieves a plus two minimum. It's now a requirement to pass the test to graduate highschool in the state of washington. I dont't but every year after mine does. Dodged a bullet is all I can say. In my opinion schools arent really doing anything scholastic anymore. All a diploma says now is "wohoo I passed a meaningless exam which has no direct bearing on my life and I can follow directions like a drone."
Enough writing for me today, I hear a beer a callin my name.

I take back my previous thought, 5:00 is way too early especially if that's when your expected there, even 6:00 is pretty bad. Everyone here is making me feel really good about my high school experience and the state of eduction down here in Texas. For us we had a standardized test much like you all said, but ours was fairly common sense or at least the major points (thus giving the teachers room to do what they are payed), straightforward, and I thought fair. We didn't need to memorize formulas they were given on the exam and all of them were multiple choice. And if you missed for that state-wide exam or class-exam as long as they knew before-hand you could appeal it or make it up.

Rus, I'm not really sure what it was that made me turn around...if I could figure that out, I could help a lot of other kids. For my school district, we had kindergarten, then grades 1-5 were in a separate school, then grades 6-8 were in a separate school, and then we had grades 9-12 in our high school. I guess I was just all psyched up that grades didn't really matter yet, but in High school, it would be different. If I didn't shape up by high school, I would fail out, wouldn't be able to get into college, and would basically destroy my life.

That said, I think it's a bit ironic, since I'm not going to college right now anyway. (long story) but I would need to pay for it all out of my own pocket, and i'm working full time (40 hrs a week) and I want to be sure to do well in the classes I am taking, so I just take a couple classes at the local technical college.

I was lucky because I live in Wisconsin. They were designing the test that kids would need to take to graduate high school, but spent tons of money on it, and didn't have enough money left to actually put the test into effect. Besides, my graduating class would have just been the guinea pigs for that experiment anyway. It would have just been to see how we did on it--not to decide if we pass or fail...

Schools put too much emphasis on grades, and especially on test scores...most tests are bogus anyway...I think it's the classes that I didn't have tests in that I actually learned more. The other classes I would just learn the material long enough to pass the test--and would have forgotten it within a month...ah, the learning curve...

That's all for now...

yes too much on test and analysis. its just crunching numbers and finding places to put them... err itll take some sort of... idk itd take a revolution to change the way schools work though, too solid in their own methods. I like this ones schools methods though. all the students got laptops... course tax's had to be crazy but they all got free laptops and all of their books and homework was on a laptop and you would just email your homework and things. great system but thats just showing my love and obsession for computers. plus i wouldnt lose my computer... but i would lose my homework if it was in sheet form. im okay on test though... they dont bother me as much as homework and i dont stress so those are what keep me going. but yeah ive ran out of points to make... ill go find some sand and build a castle... later

Woah free laptops. Wish my school would give those out. They probably could with all of the money they stole from the chess club to buy Krispy Kreme doughnuts for the student body...30 weeks in a row. Just another example of the incompetency of the school administration.

they stole chess club funds to pay for krispy kreme? that is just... a waste how incredibly stupid when budgets are already too tight. damn. oh and that school was in Main im not sure if i said that or not. our school just passed a new levy and now we have 3 new schools and they are planning on tearing down the old middle school which was found in the late 1800 or theyre leaving it there and turning it into another school... not so sure but just another fun fact... our activity center "library" at the high school has metal detectors so you cant bring a book bag or anything like that into the library else be subject to search. this seems a bit... extreme perhaps as we have only had one threat at our school and that was at the old middle school and took out major class time for searches and lectures also that was a while ago and was only threatening the principle so i say she shouldve just crawled under a rock and left us alone but... oh well. later

Yeah but thats not the best part. The money that was stolen was from a will. An old man who passed away recently left the chess club with a semi-substantial amount of money. School found the money and spent it all before the chess club even knew what happened.

whoa...thats literally just....stupid..i mean the only word for that is ignorance...they obviously value donuts more than education

wtf!! thats illegal. its specificaly chess club they should press charges against the school haha id do that, mr toadvine, our chess leader would press charges... grr ha

Well the only problem is that the chess club can't prove it. Our school's notorious for not handling money well which includes undocumented expenditures. grrrr.
...Of course that may have been intentional.

-School hates me therefore I hate it.

i want i need therefor i am(sorry that just came to mind when i read your little quote thing ahha

what is up with the poem every time you post somthing sorry but it just funny;
instead of posting it up do somthing about it lol. dont be offended jks.

I assume your talking to me. I intended it to be funny. I already actively do somting about it. I torture the administration with the law every chance I get. Schools are really bad at following the law. :-)

and without further ado -School hates me therefore I hate it.

oh thats the signeture, great song

I'm at school right now.... it's very boring....
4 hours behind a old pc...

It’s called bureaucracy. I live in California, A place where they give children calculators to kid in the fourth grade because they don’t have the time to teach. Them hell I went to my daughters seventh grade class and found calculators in here math class. I asked the teacher why they had calculators in the class and he said if they haven’t learned math by now, they’ll never get it. I said how about you teaching it to them. He had no answer. I honestly feel if the school system is kept to a minimum to keep our children less learned. And if your less learned you are less likely to vote, less likely to understand the issues at hand and less likely to fight for changes in a system that wants you ignorant to the fact. Hell according to the most resent pole shows only 14% of the parents of the children at my kid’s school have a high school diploma. That’s scary. I always thought the world was what you made and how much you achieve in school and life was all based on what you put into it. And then you have to deal with People like Bush who is slowly stripping the rights of the American people away from us in the name of profit. People like the last vice president who said the constitution is and old document. And that doesn’t mean anything any more. Other wise ignorance is bliss. Who knows this might even end up on carnivores database just for having an opinion.

Hey, you shouldn't put it all on Bush...Clinton took away people's rights to make choices for themselves too! He felt that we're not capable of making these choices on our own.

What choices did he take away, I not in complete agrement orf clinton But he offerd the charter probosal as an opp to utalise tax money to promot charter school to give an option for public shools, he was strong egual medical care and schools, And also you need to give him thereadit for abdeling the defaset. The you have now has spent three time the amount of money then any other in the last 7 administraitions. and has cut school, heakth, and social benifits by 15 % in the too years of service. They have cut after school program in half saing its the parents responsibilty to caover thet. I amd a ferm belever that our nation is resbonsible for its children not one person not 2 but all of use.

I'm lol'ing on that one prism...however Clinton deserves no credit it wasn't his choice to put the social benefits in place...they were already there. Also the deficit started under Clinton, something no one notices anymore. Also take a look at who is cutting education...has it been the state gov't? I know here in Texas things are running smoothly or at least as much so as can be hoped.

No the deficit actually incurred and had its beginnings in Regan administration. And snow balled thru the Bush Seniors Administrational the Kuwaiti war alone cost the American people alone 194 billion alone. And continue to cost us money to day. And as far as Regan the star wars programs almost bust this country in a program that didn’t work. Believed me I lived thru. I’m not a big fan of Clintons. But I do feel he did a lot of good regardless if he got caught having sex or not with a white house add. And don’t get me started on that witch hunt. If you no anything about American history you find that the bureaucrats control everything. And when anything that is implemented to help the people to empower them selfs is usually put down especially if takes money from the politicians and special Interest groups. Don’t educate them and they wont no any better. Amassing how the same state that bush was governor, the same state where his children go to school, has a great level of education then any other in the country.

The schools are so bad in some parts of california that the schools are actually teaching the students how to cheat to pass the state tests so that their schools will rate higher to prevent the state from coming in and taking over the school. I attended california schools. I wasn't the best student in the first couple years of high school as there was a CoCos restaurant next to the school where I would hang out or across from the high school to check out the college boys in sports playing. I started doing my best in college when I was there because I wanted to be there taking classes that I was interested in and the drama of high school wasn't there anymore. No one cared that you were a model in high school or a football player, you were just one of the masses in college. No one cared if you showed up or not once they got your fees. You paid for parking and books and in private schools you paid alot. You have to be motivated. But if you ever drive though a McDonalds or Carls and someone messes up your order, then you know why you want an education. Some people I know don't have an education and they are doing very well. A formal education is only one measure of intelligence. There is emotional intelligence that has value and some people have been self taught and they are smart as well. I think that one of the most important things that parents can instill in their kids is how to treat people and be loving. In my life I have found its not always the most qualified candidate that gets the job. It's the one they like the most. Being a good person that is the best thing!!!

I knew a jock who played football in high school and the teachers knew he had to have a c average to play sports so they passed him as he won the school awards. When we went to a restaurant, he would point to a picture or say Ill have anumber 3 and when the food came he was suprised at what he got. Or hed say, ill have what she is having. He was illiterate. His thinkig though was that when he was playing in the pros, he would hire someone to read for him.

Prism, I really don't think Bush will do what you're saying...he's had to focus mainly on nat'l security because if another catastrophe like 9-11 would have happened there would be no doubt that his term was a failure and he didn't do anything when he should've.(I think we should discuss this area more in the gov't thread)

Very good points kim. My thoughts on the entire matter and what i feel should be done are in earlier posts. I feel a major problem with society is the fact that people do not care either about what they're doing and thus take advantage of the situations they're in, or about the people around them. No one seems to have much motivation for doing things anymore, other than to help themselves. It's sad really.

go to government will discuse it there. but I will say one thing , All these things do have to do with education.

yes...but people need to want to learn. Prism, I don't mean to offend you, but could you spell check your posts before you post them? I was really struggling to understand your points back there...

Teachers are the least paid professionals. That is just terrible. They pay professional atheletes more than the president, and they hardly pay teachers--and they are responsible for educating our future!! That is just wrong.

My boyfriend was home-schooled after seventh grade. I don't know what is best for the kids i'll have someday...but it definately worked for him and his sister. There are a lot of problems with our educational system today...so parent's need to be active in their kid's quest for learning. Perhaps kids should be homeschooled when they reach a certain age (where they are responsible enough to look up things on their own) Maybe we should give them the freedom to seek out knowledge on their own. Some of the neatest things I have learned I have learned on my own. School doesn't have all of the answers...

I apologies I’m add with dyslectic reading problem. But I don’t lean on that as an excuse. I’ve done pretty well for my self. I some times have to read something 2 to 3 times to get it, but I still apply my self, and don’t give up. I always hated English and have a tendency to write how I feel. I’ll work on that. Thanks the constructive criticism and for the reminder. And I do agree with the comment on its all in how you apply yourself.

I am happy to hear that you dont give up.....it is all about how you apply yourelf

***This post is dedicated to 'laurengary' for the purposes of my next tpbm post***

...going to school in the US is pointless. =P Even them denmarkians are smarter....same with them koreans! Lol (as we all know, koreans are geniuses, IMHO)...(along with almost every asian country..and maybe the other 2 hundred and ...46?)

Noah, going to school in the US is definitely NOT pointless. It's where you learn the wonderful people from Denmark are NOT Denmarkians ... but are known as "Danes" D'oh !

And it's where you learn not to dredge up old threads

I love learning......but I hate school. It's a torture chamber for kids who don't fall into line with the norm. I sadly see kids get more and more &$&^ up because they don't fit in. My niece is a unsual child and school has been a tearing experience for her. If you don't know how to listen completely and be perfect in all studies, socializing and ettequite (? spelling) you are given that look, the one where the teacher has a furrowed brow while staring down thier nose at you. Man, it's just a government system, and not the myth that it is a safe place to send your kids everyday. So my solution.....I don't have one. But I think I can honestly say the only good thing I took from school is my ability to read and write. A bunch of painful years and that's all I have to show for it. I was so glad to escape..........but on another note...........university and college can be a totally different experience if you give yourself time after highschool to recover (if you must) and think about what you want to learn about. I've beem out of school for twelve years and I am just deciding now that I want to be a Nutritionist and Herbalist. But not because I have to, but because I want to. Elementary and highschool sucks. But since we have no choice but to complete it..........we are justified to complain and express the suckiness of it. Though I made some good friends at school, they were all the "Bad Kids". Not mean kids, but kids who never fit the system. We hung out by the smoking doors and banded together in our rebellion to refuse to be told were not good enough every day of the week. And people wonder why there are so many drop outs.

Keith, give him I few threads ;øP

Can we get violent with these people who dredge up old dead threads ... that died for a reason ?

You mean because it is seasonal? ;øP

stop commentin this then we can let it die again :P

Aw, but I liked this thread.

Lol lol. U actually took my 'demarkian' word for real? I was trying to set the point/mood of: i'm not so smart. =P

..hmm i forgot about this thread btw...

and no school isnt pointless in the US, i know i know, like today I learned...i learned.....i learned...that mark twain was born in new jersey?

...and raptorfalcon lives in WA

Yes, I herald from the lands of coffee beans, evil overlord Bill Gates, and Asian immigrants. We here in Washington have appologized profusesly for the creation of such evil, but alas there is nothing really we can do. Just kidding, I love bill gates. He may giving me a job someday.

OK, this thread may go back into the shadows of obscurity now if you so wish.