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Discussion Board -> Desktop Wallpaper, Art, etc. -> A brief Thank You

A brief Thank You

::CurtieBear
02/23/07 8:35 AM GMT
Well... "Appropriate Content, Snapshots ... or ?? ..."" got the Elephant Gun while I was writing.
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I would like to take a moment to say thank you for the show of support, it really does mean a lot. Honestly.

Some people have said that they would have preferred to have seen this image on another sight. Well, to let you know, I do have galleries elsewhere...
Renderosity: The comments there focus of two things lighting and expression.
DeviantArt: No comments at all
This is where I think Caedes is set apart from the rest of the sites out there - Passion. Here, people have talked about how the image makes them feel, or the feeling that the image has portrayed to them. Not about lights or expressions, but how they were moved by it.

As I have stated before:
"Remember, art, in any form, isn't just there to be pretty to the eyes. It's there to make you ask questions about your own life situations and to allow you to explore who you are, inside and out."

No, my style isn't going to appeal to everyone. Nor do I expect it too. I do stand by my work, and when someone states a disapproval to that image, I will ask them to let me know what they found inappropriate about it. To Caiden's credit, he is the only one so far to have actually come forward and stated his position. And for that, I applaud him.

My roommate and I have been talking about the furor going on here, and we started wondering... How would this image have been received if the female was in the center, or, if it was made with a tri-racial group of individuals (white, black & asian). How about if it was created with two women and one man? Another thought to this is, how would its level of "appropriateness" have been affected it the image was submitted by a woman? This last option has also been brought up in PM's here, so I figured I'd also lay it out on the table.

Would we be sitting here now, having this discussion?
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Either way... Thanks again for the support guys. Much Appreciated.

*bow*
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I always try to balance the light with the heavy - a few tears of human spirit in with the sequins and the fringes ~ Bette Midler ~ ~ (My GALLERY, such as it is.) ~ :o)

Comments

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.margali
02/23/07 7:52 PM GMT
I was sorry to see the discussion sent to the elephant graveyard too soon. Although I, personally, found it difficult to understand the views of those who considered it 'inappropriate', I thought the discussion around the image was important and much better aired than buried.

I won't repeat my comments on the image itself here, but I will say that _I_ appreciate your willingness to stand up and be counted through both your art and your discussion comments.

I once discovered that parents had reported that their daughter was "terrified" of me, her instructor. Although the parents would not come out and say it, they apparently spent three-quarters of an hour saying such things as, "Well, she has short hair... you know?". To my boss's credit, the response to these comments was something like, "No, I'm sorry. Could you explain your concerns further?" etc. I don't know what other comments were made, but imagine they got rapidly worse. _Nothing_ I had _done_ was in the least inappropriate, but the parents considered _me_ inappropriate. I know I was lucky - my boss's reaction was essentially to recognise that the problem lay with the parents and not with me. Many are not so fortunate.

We need messages which affirm the value of human relationships of friendship, of love, of family... These things are rare enough in the world as it is. For the record, I would argue that we _should_ value these wherever we find them and that we _should_ resist attempts to pervert these goods or to present them as evil. Your image depicted human strength, not human weakness; beauty, not ugliness; good not bad. And, yes, my 'should's are _moral_.

I disagree completely with claims that the image should have been posted elsewhere. Where, exactly? If Caedes were to censor images such as yours, I would very seriously consider going elsewhere since that would be to censor the richness, the value and the variety of art which should be nurtured here.

I will leave others to ponder the questions you've raised. I'll add another, though: if the image were altered in one of the suggested ways - to feature two womyn and a man, for example - would it then change the answer to the question, what if a womon had posted it?

Thank you for what you do, what you say and what you mean here on Caedes. I sincerely hope that you will continue to do, say and mean what is in your mind and your heart. Caedes would be the poorer without you as yourself.

- cfr


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::HauntingMorgana
02/23/07 8:27 PM GMT
You know, certain people will have a problem with anything. It really does not matter what it is. I also find that people will throw religion as the standing stone so to speak. Funadamental people should read their bibles more if that's the case. As I recall-

Judge not lest yourself be judged & Let he who is without sin cast the 1st stone. I'm not into religion or anything, but, those words do make sense.

There needs to be more tolerance in this world. People need to quit trying to be the ultimate police force and force feeding people what they think is right and wrong.

I also find that people that do these things, are generally unhappy with their own lives and have to find fault with others.

In either case, I’m very happy to see that your image is back up. As I stated on my other post, you have quite a bit of talant and I enjoy your works greatly.

I’m looking forward to seeing more of your works.

Michael.
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Haunting made me do it damnit.
.mesmerized
02/24/07 11:09 AM GMT
Aha, so I found another avenue to post my opinions...Ok--so I’m here against my better judgment to add my thoughts to the fray…I don’t often participate in these things anymore based on past experiences on how easy it is to be misquoted and misunderstood but what the heck, I’m feeling feisty today…first off, I think it’s safe to say that all caedes members should be willing to accept and live by the Golden Rule, that is to say, ‘them with the gold make the rules’ (yeah, the one about ‘Do unto others as you would have them do unto you’ is always a good one to keep in mind too)…in this case, the ruler is caedes…it’s his site, his vision, his right to decide what is or isn’t acceptable content for his site…as guests of his site, it’s not only common courtesy but quite reasonable to be expected to act in accordance to those rules…to his credit, he allows us the opportunity to object, criticize, and offer suggestions but in the end it’s his decision…obviously he can’t monitor everything that goes on here so he has entrusted certain individuals to do some of that for him…no one here is infallible, mistakes are made, decisions are sometimes reversed, inconsistencies arise, but for the most part they do a damn good job of it…whether you are a new member or one of long-standing, it’s always possible one of your images will be rejected or held in limbo, either due to questionable content, image quality, copyright issues etc…as Phil said, it’s nothing personal…if and when that does happen, I do agree it would be nice to know why, not only out of consideration but also that the artist might understand what not to do next time (even points made in the FAQS could be subject to interpretation)…if that individual disagrees on the rejection I also feel he/she should be given the chance to (respectfully) argue their point and sometimes a decision is overturned…given the sheer volume of images that pass inspection every day I don’t suppose anyone has a lot of time to linger over every image and ponder its’ merit or lack thereof so mistakes can be made, however, once a final decision has been made live with it…I can’t see the benefit in further argument or even why the stakes should be so high as to cause a lot of conflict…we’re all just doing this for fun, to share, and learn; no one is getting rich because of it…if any one individual repeatedly finds themselves at odds with the rules or policies, be they image content, c-index etc. perhaps they should ask themselves if this is the right site for them…no one can expect the rules to change just for them and we’re all just doing the best we can…

To ::hudakore in particular… I’m sorry to learn that one of your images was rejected causing you to delete your gallery…that is one of yours I had not seen so cannot comment on it…I am, however, glad to see you have resumed posting…I am an instant fan of your works, as are several others, and wouldn’t let the exclusion of one image deter me from further posting as I’m certain more positive comments are forthcoming given the artistry in the majority of your images and as already mentioned, this can happen to anyone…

And now to .Caiden…I will try to be brief but could probably write volumes in response to you…not only with regards to Curt’s recent images but also because you and I have met before on similar issues…unfortunately that particular image is no longer in my gallery…perhaps you will remember it?…it was a painting my daughter did of a very young girl scantilly clad sitting at the end of her bed with her head turned aside…the image was titled Shame…there was no mistaking it’s message or the emotion in her face…it was in fact, more obvious than those of Curt’s but passed inspection by the image mods and outside of yourself, it was accepted in a positive way for what it was…but then, as now, you took exception to the image, in particular her state of undress, though the image was neither detailed, nor pornographic…I recall pointing out to you that it was done by my daughter, herself only in her early teens at the time and done at the request of her art teacher at school to portray the suffering of children in a variety of ways around the world and part of a series showing children suffering hunger, physical abuse, the ravages of war etc.…I also pointed out how art and indeed life itself is not always pretty and that the image, as in Curt’s case, was not overtly graphic in nature…I do recognize and respect that as a Christian you feel some obligation and fervor to ‘spread the Word’ so I am not trying to demean you or your values and can partially understand your (hopefully) good intentions but this is not the arena for that…you do have the right to express your dislike of an image…however, as one with Christian values myself, I would caution that to continue to revisit that same image and then conduct a moral or religious debate, not only on the image but on its’ creator and the commenters as well, is presumptuous and every bit as inappropriate and distasteful as any interpretation you might have given that image…we are not here to cast judgment on one anothers’ character, values, or chosen lifestyle but to share art and I would add, to recklessly sit in judgment of others at any time is biblically unsound, (“You without sin cast the first stone”) and smacks of intolerance…I personally am quite comfortable and appreciative of the artistry, skill, and depiction of emotion portrayed in all 3 of Curt’s recent images and find nothing wrong with them, regardless of any prior knowledge as to the sexual orientation of their creator…to suggest that someone viewing them is likely to be led or tempted to go off in search of pornographic images and sites because of viewing them is ludicrous…to what degree of interpretation one wants to take theses images is all in the mind of the beholder…well, there’s my two cents worth, and a few dollars besides.:Pat.
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::purmusic
02/24/07 1:35 PM GMT
^^^^ She's Canadian you know. ^^^^

Well said Pat.

Cookies are on me, this round. :o)
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The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new landscapes, but in having new eyes. - Marcel Proust
+ppigeon
02/24/07 3:47 PM GMT
The only rejected image was called 'Male divinity' and had a S&M tendancy.
CurtieBear must know that we have here at caedes.net some very young members and this image was really "borderline"...
The other images are welcome!
Another thing: this was not a caedes decision, but a decision taken between the moderators. Mmmh... difficult job... ;-)
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-Pierre-
::CurtieBear
02/24/07 4:48 PM GMT
Ah, yes... "Male Divinity". That one I was fully prepared to not make muster. In fact I even PM'd a mod, as well as another member, about it. They, personally, were not offended by it, but I was also warned that others may pull it. Which is OK, because I knew full well that one was "on the edge".

As for our more vocal younger members, don't discount them please. They are very bright and can express themselves very well and intelligently. Overlooking the crazziness that happens in the 'Off Topic Threads', they are also very capable of handling themselvs in a more mature manner than some of the adults here.

Yes, I am also fully aware, that when I post an image, our younger members will see it. I also know that they are also still forming opinions about the world around them. In fact, I don't think we ever stop forming those opinions. So, what I seek to accomplish with my images is to show a different world, send a message, and let people know that you don't need to be ashamed of who you are.

One thing is also obvious, should I decide to post another render here, especially one with the story behind it, I'm going to have to spell it out for the viewers. Or, at least, the thought processes I was running through when I put it together.
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I always try to balance the light with the heavy - a few tears of human spirit in with the sequins and the fringes ~ Bette Midler ~ ~ (My GALLERY, such as it is.) ~ :o)
&nmsmith
02/24/07 11:21 PM GMT
You do awesome work, my friend. Keep after it.
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.animaniactoo
02/25/07 4:13 AM GMT
Truth my friend? There is no need to explain. From what I see, 95% of the site got it the 1st time... w/out the explanation.

We spend a bit too much time being pro-active about defending against people who won't accept even after explanation... so be yourself, and let them be themselves.

No shame on your end. 8•)
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One man sees things and says "why?" - but I dream things that never were and I say "why not?"
.artytoit
02/26/07 8:04 PM GMT
I've only just seen this thread and checked out the image... and it's great! It's certainly no more shocking than the thought of Mick Jagger, Marianne Faithful and a Mars Bar lol. Anyway, a bit of controversy never did anyones artistic career any harm!
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