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Learning Forum

::regmar
06/30/05 1:27 PM GMT
As the site has grown in membership I've noticed a problem that my communications with a friend has brought to light. Photographers who are learning seem to be afraid to post on the site out of fear that they can't live up to the level of such titans as Pierre, Lucy, Daryll, Sam, Josh, etc. I feel that this is going to drive some people with real potential off the site, and limit its growth. Aside from this I feel that Caedes inclusivity is what drew me here when I started out, and I hate to think that might disappear and that new arrivals won't experience the same level of acceptance that I did.

How can we resolve this? Maybe a "Critiques" gallery for new photographers to get advice from those titans instead of competing with them. I know you're going to say there's no competition at Caedes, but there is. When I look through the "New Images" pages, I cherry-pick the images on which I want to comment and vote. Those images whose authors may not have the experience of the aforementioned titans don't get noticed, so their work silently dies without comment. Do we want this?

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ж Regmar ж

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trisbert
06/30/05 2:49 PM GMT
No we don’t want that. However the sheer number of images arriving each day means people will cherry pick simply to cope with all those images, especially if they are on dial up like me. The Titans you mentioned gave me much encouragement when I began to post and they continue to encourage beginners today. They should be recognised and commended for it too. I try to encourage beginners that show some merit but I don’t want to ignore those that teach me by example either (call me selfish if you like).

I think the real answer to the problem is to find another half a dozen dedicated souls who have the diplomatic skill, broad artistic knowledge and the time to look out for the beginners.
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
::regmar
06/30/05 3:31 PM GMT
My concern is not so much that the members here don't want to help beginners, but that they won't find the beginners, because of the volume of images they have to peruse, and because those among us who are experienced have different needs from those who are just beginning.
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ж Regmar ж
trisbert
06/30/05 3:56 PM GMT
I think I understand where your concerns are Regmar. It bothers me too. But if we were to have a beginner’s gallery who would determine when they move on to the regular gallery’s? And would people really want to post into a beginner’s gallery or would it put them off? Perhaps it’s one of those try it and see what happens things.
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
::regmar
06/30/05 5:57 PM GMT
Good question, specially about the movement to permanent galleries. I don't know what to do about that. Maybe we could deal with them the same way we do now. Maybe the Learning forum could be separate from the galleries, so the images would age off after x amount of time. If the user wanted to put the images into the galleries, they could upload them again there. Hmmmm...
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ж Regmar ж
+ppigeon
06/30/05 7:08 PM GMT
I think the problem developed by Regmar has nos solution... Because the site grows unceasingly. Experienced members (and Mods) can't follow to look, vote, comment, ...
The result is a self-regulation: the new inexperienced members must be patient, request advices, take part in the forums, deliver opinions... If they do that, they will be integrated in this nice community. If they don't, they are discouraged. The site must be deserved, it is not due...
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-Pierre-
::dreamer100
06/30/05 10:07 PM GMT
How about a 'New artists" catagory where the first four or five uploads from anyone would automatically go? People might be more apt to check out a smaller more condensed version of "New Images" Being summer here and working outdoors and having work done inside too I know I'm guilty of the "pop in" and I don't have a couple of hours a day to spend right now.
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+ppigeon
07/01/05 6:36 AM GMT
Nice idea Kilie. We could create a "New images->First posts" gallery. So the new member could choose this gallery and experienced members could look at this gallery firstly. We don't need an automatic system. The new member decides himself to use or not this possibility.
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-Pierre-
trisbert
07/01/05 7:21 AM GMT
That idea might work Kilie. It’s voluntary so no one would feel obliged to post there if they didn’t want too.
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
+Samatar
07/04/05 10:56 PM GMT
Sounds good to me. We would have to make sure that it didn't become a snapshot gallery though where fly-by-nights just uploaded photos of their friends, cats, holiday snaps etc. It would only be for people who are genuinly interested in artistic feedback.
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-Everyone is entitled to my opinion- Visit the new improved rescope.com.au
+ppigeon
07/05/05 6:17 AM GMT
Mod's job! ;-)
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-pierre-
carleen4155
07/05/05 10:40 AM GMT
I'm a beginner and really appreciate any advice I can get.
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Love what you do, do what you love.
::regmar
07/05/05 12:48 AM GMT
I like the idea of having a place where I can go and know that anyone who posts there expects criticism and not simply back-slapping. This forum (gallery) would have the additional benefit of ensuring that the beginners' works don't get ignored in the flood of works from more experienced people.
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ж Regmar ж
+ppigeon
07/05/05 2:19 PM GMT
Done! I created a new gallery. I move there some of carleen4155 first posts. Hope it will encourage people to look, criticize and comment...
link
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-pierre-
noobguy
07/05/05 5:09 PM GMT
nearly every one of the images I post to caedes is new and experimental since I am just starting out and learning and trying new things and therefore not many are very "competitive". I think i could benefit from the kind of "risk free" critique that Regmar has suggested at the very top of this discussion. I think others could as well, particularly new users.
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"Then as it was, Then again it will be. An' though the course may change sometimes, Rivers always reach the sea."
+ppigeon
07/05/05 5:10 PM GMT
Anthony: you are not an "inexperienced" guy... ;-)
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-pierre-
::JOHANNA
07/05/05 5:18 PM GMT
Agree with you Anthony!!!
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Carpe diem....
noobguy
07/05/05 5:38 PM GMT
:p - i like to play, i could submit a bunch of walmart calender prints and compete for high ratings but I like to experiment and learn new things
and compared to the "titans" mentioned earlier(like mr. Pierre :p) , i'm quite inexperienced

I visited the first image gallery, quite a nifty addition, I will probably visit it frequently as it will refreshing to see new styles and get to know new artists. eine gute idee
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"Then as it was, Then again it will be. An' though the course may change sometimes, Rivers always reach the sea."
::JOHANNA
07/05/05 6:23 PM GMT
Smile!! Anthony.(lol).
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Carpe diem....
whiskey_girl
07/06/05 12:31 AM GMT
yay reg! you're awesome for listening and getting this whole thing started. i appreciate your comments and criticism on all of my pictures that you have seen so far. you have given me the confidence to post on here. thanks!! :D
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"Come, give us a taste of your quality." Hamlet, Act ii, Scene 2
+ppigeon
07/06/05 1:21 PM GMT
After a discussion with Caedes and other Mods, we will stop here the try with the "New images->First uploads" gallery. The "Lonely images" gallery was created for images which are not sufficiently seen and are not commented on.
New members can also PM experienced members to receive helps and advices.
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-pierre-
::dreamer100
07/06/05 6:47 PM GMT
As soon as I brought it up I second guessed it. We can continue to break these things down into a million different catagories with sub catagories making it harder for those who don't know the site well to find anything. I see a lot of people throwing things into the wrong catagory anyway. I'd still like to see some sort of tutorial on how to navigate around in Caedes for the new folks and where the hot spots are on the page for the new folks, but that's a different thread..........
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trisbert
07/06/05 10:06 PM GMT
Isn’t that what the FAQ is for?
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
*caedes
07/07/05 10:12 AM GMT
I think that if we need a tutorial in order to navigate the site that that means the navigation needs to be fixed.
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-caedes
::Morwyn
07/07/05 1:20 PM GMT
I don't have any problem navigating the site and never have .. Everything is plainly laid out and easy to use..
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bjb
07/07/05 1:54 PM GMT
Where did the new gallery go?
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When you get the choice to sit it out or dance, I hope you dance... Leanne Womack
trisbert
07/07/05 2:00 PM GMT
I was wondering where it got to as well.
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
::ieliles
07/07/05 2:58 PM GMT
I also think this site is easy to navigate. My biggest beef with web design is busyness on a page and I don't think Caedes has this at all.
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::regmar
07/07/05 3:19 PM GMT
I understand why the Lonely Images gallery is there, but the specific reason I wanted to have a voluntary Learning Forum is so people who want to offer helpful critiques could do so knowing that the people receiving the critique actually wanted criticism, not simply praise.

Now I realize that all galleries are supposed to be for criticism, but in reality criticism is likely to get your c-index slaughtered by vindictive people who are competing for praise. Alas!

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ж Regmar ж
trisbert
07/08/05 5:44 AM GMT
Could we know why the First uploads gallery was removed please?
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross
+ppigeon
07/08/05 11:04 AM GMT
Robert: see my comment on 07/06/05. The 'First uploads' gallery makes double employement with the 'Lonely images' gallery, which was created for the same reason. The difference between the two galleries was just that the new members could decide themselves to put their first entries into the "First uploads".
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-pierre-
trisbert
07/08/05 12:20 AM GMT
Thanks Pierre. I misunderstood that one, I must be going senile or something.
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There are three colours, Ten digits and seven notes, its what we do with them that’s important. Ruth Ross

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