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Discussion Board -> Desktop Wallpaper, Art, etc. -> Should we be nice?

Should we be nice?

DigitalFX
08/30/05 1:07 AM GMT
I know this topic has been discussed before. I have a slightly different approach. I'm a nice person, and I think that nice comments are nice. BUT, I think most of us have honest opinions that we keep to ourselves and it makes me look bad because I try to give honest and helpful comments to our folks. When everybody is saying WOW what and awesome picture" and I'm saying"Well, it's a lovely compositiong, but you could improve it by messing with levels in Photoshop if you have it." I just plane look like the bad guy. How can we resolve this?
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-DFX - "Come away with me to a fractal sea where the digital dophins flow."

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XYZ
08/30/05 1:29 AM GMT
No, well yes, I believe that you should say what you feel about the image but don't be over negative about the image, some ppl on the site are probably sensitive but I think the ones that aren't that nice are the ones you can benefit from most.
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DixieNormus
08/30/05 2:31 AM GMT
I NEED honest ctiticism. I've said that many times while here. I admire a person who can look at my work, and tell me if it needs improvement. Of course, it is also nice to have someone tell me that they like my work. If they like my work it's due to the honest criticism that I've gotten in the past. Does anyone remember my first uploads? Thanks for suffering through them by the way =0) LOL. Although they got spun down to the Caedes cesspool, I've saved them on my hard-drive. When I see them now...I use them for inspiration, because they suck really bad, and I've been told that I've gotten much better. So please. By all means...criticise away. I'll be all the better for it. Not everyone can accept honesty, but if the truth hurts....just blow them away with your next image. =0)
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=xentrik
08/30/05 2:43 AM GMT
Well Peter, the thing is that not everyone has an eye tuned enough to suggest something like levels correction or any number of other tweaks. By suggesting something, you're bringing in a different viewpoint, which may help people after you see what you see, and give everyone a better sense of style. The alternative is that everyone (or the author) sees what you see and disagrees, and they then have a different style they prefer to work towards in future. No matter what you suggest, someone's gaining something.
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DevilsJohnson_2
08/30/05 2:50 AM GMT
lol...It's good to be nice but in leaving comments on an image that is asking for feedback what good is a "Grreat Job!" when it might not be. I think it is wise to grade on a curve so to speak and I wouldn't tear someone down but I have had people leave me ideas and that has helped me somewhat in what I post here. LOL, me not being near as good as a lot of the people in the genre of images I post I like those little nuggets if wisdom.

Images that even I can tell are not done with much imagination I will usually leave alone and not say anything. I usually don't vote for them either being I just don't want to crush someone's desire to try. The first few I posted here were not well recieved and a few people gave me ideas to make them better and possibly delete, re-work and repost the image. That can be done in a manner that is not really negitive. This collection of people is for the most part real talented. Look in the galleries over the last few months, the bar has been raising. The charactor of the people as a whole is mostly postitive. I think a lot of people remember when they were not as good as they are now and try to advise. That's been my expierence anyway. I've been thankfull for that. I would not have kept posting images and possibly stopped trying had the case been different.
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tommy62
08/30/05 3:01 AM GMT
Well Peter i think you can ask first if they are interested in constructive critisicm. The answer on that question will give you some indicators if its welcomed or not. See you!
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" Today Is That Tomorrow We Worried About Yesterday"
J_272004
08/30/05 3:19 AM GMT
maybe a little box can be put on the page that can be ticked that says "constructive critisicm welcome" that way if its marked then critiscise away... if not... "nice work.. good job".. =) just a thought
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"The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt with the heart." --Helen Keller
+tbob
08/30/05 3:57 AM GMT
Why cant you be nice and critical at the same time likeDigitalFX's example?
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co2metal
08/30/05 4:13 AM GMT
I like to do exactly Peter's example, and after doing so, if they get offended then I just won't offer help. If they appreciate it, then I'll continue to do so.. It sure makes me feel more satisfied than if I were to say "Wow, nice!"... I guess that it's just that i am quite the perfectionist, so if i find things in images that could be improved, I usually have no problem letting them know, in the most pleasant way possible.
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click here for pure excellence
prismmagic
08/30/05 5:57 AM GMT
I'm the kind of person who would rather be told some honest words then to have smoke blown up my rear end. I sometimes will give an ok crtic and then pm them with suggestion. I look at this way you can only grow when you have honest mentors.
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Art is the perception of the creator. Meaning is the perception of the viewer. acceptance is the perception of society.
J_272004
08/30/05 6:45 AM GMT
i suggested the box for critics so the ones who want it can say so.. because some on here explode if you suggest anything.... i suppose another way would be to write in the description.. critics welcome...
just suggesting it so it would cut down on the bitching, backstabbing and attack voting which seems to be going on because of a suggestion on images..

personally i dont think there is anything wrong with saying that an image is "nice" or "good job..." i say it plus i say what i like about the image.. i say these things why? because they are good... i have pm people a couple of times (mainly people who are just learning) suggest an improvement eg. contrast, sharpening etc and even offer to do it so they can see the difference... then show them how to do it...
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"The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt with the heart." --Helen Keller
::Radjehuty
08/30/05 11:29 AM GMT
Well I think that if one is going to pursue in some form of art, they MUST be open to criticism. In the other thread about defining art, we have definately found that art is SO subjective and there is bound to be different oppinions across the population of this site. Honestly, if someone isn't able to take criticism, than they probably shouldn't upload any works.

I've always endured criticism, on caedes and in real life, and I have to say that if I was never criticized at all then I would still be drawing like a 6 yearold. Yes it is nice to have some positive feedback, but once in a while I appreciate some honesty from experianced or not experianced users.
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"The person who says it cannot be done, should not interrupt the person doing it." -Chinese Proverb
Nikoli
08/30/05 11:43 AM GMT
I completely agree with Peters first comment. As a person who wants to improve I would prefer not to be wrapped in cotton wool. As I said in another discussion contrsturctive feedback in regards to my trade @ the time is going to help me learn, especially when this site has some very skilled and dedicated followers. With their help and guidance hopefully I will improve. This would not be the case if I did not get any feedback. Carpe Diem.
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"We are only as complicated as the life we make for ourselves"! NJ
DigitalFX
08/30/05 1:00 PM GMT
Several of you have given me good ideas on this. Thankyou. I figured if a person posted an image that they where honestly looking for critique and suggestions. I know so little compared to my professional associates and I'm aware that my suggestions could be not quite on the mark, so it does take some courage to make them. Also I post my own work and open it for critique...One think I have noticed that is helpful...Since most people know that I will critique their work, many do post suggestions about my work. I do appreciate that.J_2 had an interesting suggestion about adding a little check box. Tommy62, our suggeston won't work because I often don't get back to see if I have permission to post suggestions. Sometimes I post them in private, if they are major, but then others don't see them. I for one have learned a lot here by reading suggestions. I also see the point that some people don't feel qualified. I buy that too. But I think that each of us has opinions and I worry that we are nice because we want to hear mostly nice things about ourselves in return. So from now on I'm going to try to be "nice" but I'm still going to make suggestions in as nice a way as I can.
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-DFX - "Come away with me to a fractal sea where the digital dophins flow."
::Morwyn
08/30/05 1:04 PM GMT
I have always been open to honest critisim.. I can't improve if I don't know what is wrong.. If someone sees something on one of my images, they think needs work, I will gladly listen.. I don't understand why anyone woudln't .. What I don't like is rudeness.. There is a way to give critisize, without being rude.. I have had very few rude comments on my images, but I have seen them on others..
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One bead at a time..
::groo2k
08/30/05 2:02 PM GMT
I agree that anyone who posts is open to criticisms and suggestions. However, I try to factor in the age and the skill level of the member to determine the amount of positive/negative feedback needed. Also, if I criticize I will always point out something about the image that I DO like. That being said, you have to become hardened and thick-skinned to open yourself up to criticism but at the same time you have to be confident in your work and skills to keep going forward without taking the critiques negatively.
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::Radjehuty
08/30/05 6:16 PM GMT
Yes I agree with groo2k. The type of critiques I would give heavily depend on the age of the artist. Not to say I would just water it down to the point where it wouldn't help anything, but in either case, I wouldn't be intentionally rude.

Actually the reason that I upload is soley because I want critiques. Why else would one want to upload to a massive audience? Yes it is satisfying when people like your images, but people wouldn't like your images if you didn't develope a skill...
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"The person who says it cannot be done, should not interrupt the person doing it." -Chinese Proverb
+Samatar
08/31/05 12:16 AM GMT
I've always had positive responses to the criticism I offer. I think the key is just to be tactful (ie "nice and critical at the same time" as tbob put it).
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-Everyone is entitled to my opinion- Visit the new improved rescope.com.au
DigitalFX
09/01/05 5:04 AM GMT
Yeah, I think tact is the key all round. I prolly need to work on my tact quotient. The one time I usually loose tact altogether is when I see a rip. I just can't stand people taking credit for other people's work. That could be a whole new discussion in fact.
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-DFX - "Come away with me to a fractal sea where the digital dophins flow."
::verenabloo
09/01/05 8:01 AM GMT
A person who is an artist expects critique...they want it..good or bad...nice or not nice...it helps the artist to evaluate himself thru other peoples eyes...because we are our own worst critics...so we must rely on what others say...and then make our own judgement as to what we need to do. But I think it is of utmost importance for people to be totally honest, but to do so in a tactful loving way....None of us are totally right..and none of us know the perfect solutions for anyone elses creations..but yes tact is the answer...plus we really need to use empathy..putting ourselves into the shoes of the "other guy"...speaking in a kind but truthfull way. I like the definition of
EMPATHY :::::"the capacity for experiencing as ones own the feelings of another"...that ought to help us most of all....
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To love what you do and feel that it matters---how could anything be more fun??!!
::Radjehuty
09/01/05 12:23 AM GMT
Agreed Verena...we really are our own worste critics :)
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"The person who says it cannot be done, should not interrupt the person doing it." -Chinese Proverb
tommy62
09/01/05 10:19 PM GMT
Until you meet the media!! ;-)
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" Today Is That Tomorrow We Worried About Yesterday"
DigitalFX
09/02/05 3:19 AM GMT
Verena...good way to put it. I believe the problem is that some of us are our own worst critics...too much so. Some of the best artists don't like their own work. Others are so in love with their productions that they can't see the lack of inherent communication. But I agree any good artist is going to be open to critique, especially from people they respect. Nobody wants criticism from people the DON'T respect. That is kind of a key of some sort.
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-DFX - "Come away with me to a fractal sea where the digital dophins flow."

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